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Old 04-19-2010, 08:05 AM   #1
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Default Consistent Rule Enforcement

Please let me preface by saying that this is not a complaint against the people who moderate this forum, or the rules of the forum. I strongly agree that a forum like this needs rules and the rules need to be enforced. However I would like to see the rules enforced consistently. I know that the moderators donate their time and I'm grateful for all that they do. I know that there are many different people who moderate and they all bring their perspective to the table which can cause some variations in how any specific message is viewed. I'm not really talking about those things though so please don't let the conversation become bogged down with things like what I have already mentioned. I respect the board admin and everyone who volunteers their time to make this a great place to call an online home.

Yesterday I posted a message in a thread about autism because two of my children who are also members of WI have autism and I wanted to talk about the effects of autism in WW. I was actually pointing out how WI helped my autistic child with one of the aspects of autism that affects his daily life and about 3/4 of my message was edited because it included "trade talk". I would normally take the slap to the wrist and learn from it except that the rule about "trade talk" is enforced so inconsistently that as an avid reader of WI I honestly could not see how any of what I posted should have violated any rules.

I actually have a copy of what I posted because before I hit send on any message I copy it so if something goes wrong in the sending I only have to paste the message into a new reply box. When I saw that my post had been edited the way that it had I pasted into an email and what I wrote was still in que so I read it again to see if I wrote something that I didn't remember writing but as I read it over again I didn't see anything that hasn't been written and left unmoderated on WI many times before.

I wrote that my autistic child tends to believe everything that people say is true and that has caused him to be scammed a lot. Clubhouse & Kinzville Park If a person reads this part of our forum they would get the impression that it's okay to say that they got scammed, or that scammers are in the clubhouse.

I wrote that he use to trade his good items for bad items because he didn't know better. Again, not knowing the value of items is a common topic in the forum I linked in this conversation.

I wrote that the same issue plagues him in his day to day life and that he works with a therapist on that issue. I cannot imagine for the life of me why that part was deleted.

I wrote that after becoming a member of WI he learned what a scam is and about item values. Again, those are both common topics in the clubhouse forum. I also think that's a huge compliment to WI.

I wrote that he eventually learned enough from WI that he was able to trade for bunny ears. While that could be considered "trade talk" it's nothing more than what people write in the "Look what I got" forum. Look What I Got!

While I understand that it would be impossible to make deletions and edits 100% consistent I think that it's possible to make it something other than hit and miss. I understand editing my messages if I break a rule but I don't understand it when my message isn't as explicit as many messages that have been allowed to stay active. I didn't want to highlight any specific messages for fear of embarrassing the authors but I bet that I could find at least 50 messages that have remained unedited with more specific "trade talk" than I included in my message.
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Old 04-19-2010, 08:22 AM   #2
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

I agree with consistent rule enforcement, for sure. To quote my own post regarding the trade talk rule from a slightly older thread than this one...
Quote:
Well, I had a nice and long reply typed up this morning, but then, of course, I lost connection to teh intrawebz and shut my laptop off without saving it (insert Homer Simpson "Doh!"). But, I'll try to cover most of what I said...

I think that the rule banning talk of clubhouse trades needs to be reconsidered, or the announcement removed.


Why?
1) The announcement could be interpreted as contradicting the rule.
2) The rule is oft-confusing (at least it was for me for the first year or so of being on WI).
3) There is talk of scammers in the clubhouse multiple times on a daily basis; this *could* be interpreted as violating the rule.

So, with that said, I'm not saying that stripping the rule completely is the only thing that would help. I am saying that one of these three things could help avoid confusion, as well as aid clarity:
1) The rule is actually stripped.
2) The rule is clarified, and either enforced to its fullest extent (outlawing the discussion of scammers) or added on to to reflect exceptions for discussing scammers.
3) The announcement is pulled.

That is my opinion, anyway.
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Old 04-19-2010, 08:36 AM   #3
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

There's a lot of stuff on here about not Trade Talking... you're not allowed to say specifics.

Specific:

I traded *insert item* for *insert item*


Not Specific (not sure if the mods would allow it, but it's fine in my opinion):

I traded one of my good items for someone else's bad item.

And the part following it was cut out just to make sense. Otherwise, it would just say "the same issues happen in real life, too", and members reading it would be like "WHAT issues? "

So sorry that this happened to you... But this has happened to all of us at one point or another, don't worry; it's not just you.

And if you see a message with specific trade talk in it, you click the little red flag to report it, and type in "This person is trade-talking", or something along those lines. Mods will look at it and determine whether it should be edited or not (99% of the time, it will be).
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Old 04-19-2010, 08:44 AM   #4
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

Crazysince95, thank you for sharing your perspective.

B1usk, thank you for posting. I do know what the rules state. I was talking about the inconsistent way in which the rule was enforced. The edit on the post I was discussing didn't take out parts that didn't need to be removed in order to leave my post intelligible. The edit actually made my post nonsensical. I stated at one point that my child believes almost everything that he is told then right after, due to editing it states that I pray some of that will transfer to his day to day life. It made the post look ridiculous.
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Old 04-19-2010, 02:55 PM   #5
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

Copius, this is one of the better threads I have seen lately. I know the WI staff are all volunteers, and I appreciate that. However, I think they should all be on the same page a bit more. Several times, I have flagged posts when parents posted their childrens' ages. Most of the time, the age gets edited, which is what is supposed to happen. But, every once in awhile, I get a PM from a staff member saying that it is perfectly okay to post your childrens' ages. I have also flagged numerous posts/threads that have had rules that were being broken (rules that I had not heard of, but had been told by a moderator that we cannot do), only to be left unedited. It seems like each staff member has its own editing guidelines.

The staff here is wonderful, but I think it would be wonderful if everyone was on the same page.
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Old 04-19-2010, 03:37 PM   #6
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

i have to agree. i began a thread to bring awareness to the issues surrounding the rare retirement. i got edited because the beginning of my post was viewed as a petition. i reread it over and over and couldn't understand how that was true! but everyone has there own view on things, even with guidelines

i am sure that when a member moves up the ranks here they are required to read and understand all the rules and work with a member like a mentor, kind of like the trainee program for becoming gifted.

i know it's unfair and frustrating when you get edited but it is just part of being on a forum. without a system of mod'ing this site would fall apart. there has to be some sort of structure.
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Old 04-19-2010, 03:41 PM   #7
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

http://www.webkinzinsider.com/forum/...-posting-3999/

It would be very helpful to all if these rules were actually read prior to posting. It looks like your issue has been peacefully resolved, and we all make mistakes now and then, we're humans, not computers. And we are all on the same page as to wanting the best for this forum and all members, and for all to have fun and be safe!
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Old 04-19-2010, 05:35 PM   #8
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

Thanks for this memo Copious. I have learned alot from your post. I did not know that April was such a special month, or that some members on here had Autisum. Please don't take my post the wrong way, I too have a loved one with Autism, so I understand what you are trying to say. I am glad that WI has been helpful to him. I must spend some time reading the thread for special needs children.
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Old 04-19-2010, 06:16 PM   #9
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

Oh, Copious, in my opinion, truer words were never spoken!!!!

Yes, it is time consuming to moderate these posts, and I do sincerely applaud the efforts that the Mods put forth, but they all need to apply the rules the same across the board for everyone. My problem with inequality is the fact that most times, the posts about "See what I got" or "I finally got so and so for so and so" or "That pet tried to scam me. I put up so and so, and they expected me to trade that for food", come from "Gift trainees, Gifted, or Gift Gurus". Now why are they allowed to post things like that? I thought that to be "Gifted" they needed to "swear" that they would not post fluff or anything detrimental to the rules and regulations of . They should be setting examples for the rest of us, but they seem to "skate by" more times than not. I see this frequently, and it upsets me that there are so many inconsistancies. The rule should be the rule. If has a "NO trade talk" policy, then "NO trade talk" should be the policy, No IFS, ANDS, OR BUTS, regardless of who is doing the posting.
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Old 04-19-2010, 06:36 PM   #10
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Default Re: Consistent Rule Enforcement

I think a lot of these situations have to do with the motive of the person posting it. For instance; "Look what I got!" is different than "Look what I have". One is sort of just celebrating a great addition to their collection, and the other is advertising. I can see how this could be really difficult to moderate because you have to sort of make a judgement call on the poster's intention.
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