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Old 01-17-2012, 07:10 PM   #21
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Default Re: Our Internet?

I just learned that to protest this act, Wikipedia will be "blacking out" for 24 hours.

I wish more sites would do something like this so the government will wake up and smell the coffee.. :/
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Old 01-17-2012, 07:36 PM   #22
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Default Re: Our Internet?

View Post Originally Posted by Mint Chip
If they do this, occupying wall street will look like a family reunion.
agree i can see that,and if they do that i have no clue what i'm going to do but all i know is if this goes through America is gonna descend into a nice little he*l
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Old 01-17-2012, 08:05 PM   #23
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Default Re: Our Internet?

View Post Originally Posted by chatterbox4eva39
ok honestly i was freaked out about that too
but really
no sane person in this country would ever let that bill pass
if it did, extreme riots would take place as it infringes on many of our rights
we have nothing to worry about
this
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Old 01-18-2012, 03:08 AM   #24
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Default Re: Our Internet?

I do truly think that this won't happen, but when I look around I see other places/forums like have major discussions on this. And like sherds97 said, Wikipedia is having a black-out day where no one can use the site today to protest the SOPA. Have you seen google today? It has a black bar over of "Google" on the home page and when you mouse over it, it says "Tell Congress: Please don't censor the web!"

On 12/21/11 there were over 60 major Associations supporting the SOPA Bill. Other companies surely have come on since then. Here's something I got off of the savetheinternet blog.

"Company........Total campaign contributions.......Total lobbyist spending
CBS Corp.-......................$1,191,253...............................$26,613,000
Comcast Corp.-.............$24,823,283............................$81,457,323
Disney-............................$21,064,987............................$57,581,991
News Corp.-....................$8,149,974...............................$61,239,000

These companies aren’t flushing dollars down the toilet; they’re investing in Washington with the expectation that, when bills they like come before their beneficiaries in Congress, the vote will go the “right” way. Cue SOPA and PIPA."

Last edited by pandafan7515; 01-18-2012 at 03:12 AM..
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Old 01-18-2012, 03:34 AM   #25
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Default Re: Our Internet?

The Founding Fathers must be rolling in their graves over all the rights we have lost.
Brilliant Congress passed the Patriot Bill, but not one member took the time to read it - and we pay them for this?
Now they may just listen to big business.
Maybe a sane person wouldn't pass it, but we're talking about Congress.
If they won't read something dealing with basic rights, do you expect them to read SOPA? Or understand?
Will they next charge us for the air we breathe?
The bards of old kept our culture & knowledge alive; SOPA would be a nail in its coffin.

I support the WIKI blackout today! NO SOPA!


regarding "They shelved it" :
It was shelved because both parties have major retreats this week.
It is expected to be brought back up in February.

And Obama can't prevent something from passing.
He can veto a bill, but Congress can override a veto.

I just don't have faith in politicians. Most trained as lawyers, and they learn to talk out of the side
of their mouth to support their client regardless of whether they think they are guilty or not.
As often comes up in movies, as long as they don't know for sure, they are living by their professional code.

==================
Update: Here is a great piece from elsewhere by their member kllangellier:

I don't mean to be rude, but I don't think you quite understand what these sites are protesting. They ARE against piracy. They are also against censorship. US citizens would not be allowed to use many sites, including Amazon (didn't they just buy Woot or something?), Youtube, Wikipedia... And hey, you know that Facebook thing? Yeah, they'd get shut down too. Even if they disabled sharing links, all it would take is someone taking a video of their family singing Happy Birthday to a 5 year old and BAM Facebook is in violation. Or hey, what if you and a friend decide to meet up after having not seen each other in forever? You take a picture, and load it on Facebook. You know that shirt you're wearing? Well, that design is someone's intellectual property. And now, you've just uploaded an image to the internet that contains intellectual property / copyrighted material (that you don't own) for people to view. YOU have just broken the law.
...



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Last edited by Twizzlerz; 01-18-2012 at 07:37 AM..
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Old 01-18-2012, 08:06 AM   #26
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Default Re: Our Internet?

View Post Originally Posted by Mint Chip
If they do this, occupying wall street will look like a family reunion.
YES!

OK, so I just put in a little research to see what this law would do, and the basses of it is pretty much to block sights and particular places with copyright infringement. However, it would give incredible power to the government. They could perfectly easily block something that wasn't copyrighted. (Anti-government sights for example). They could monitor Facebook and twitter and have the ability to delete posts (or tweets). I think it is putting too much in government hands and should be protested. NO SOPA!

Note: An easy way to protest is to click on the Google image which will direct you to place that will allow you to add your name to a perdition against this bill.

Last edited by labradorian; 01-18-2012 at 08:16 AM..
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Old 01-18-2012, 10:26 AM   #27
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Default Re: Our Internet?

Here are a few quotes from one of the bills... I can't remember if I pulled it from SOPA or PIPA, but they're quite similar anyway.
Quote:
No cause of action shall lie in any Federal or State court or administrative agency against, no person may rely in any claim or cause of action against, and no liability for damages to any person shall be granted against, a service provider, payment network provider, Internet advertising service, advertiser, Internet search engine, domain name registry, or domain name registrar for taking any action described in section 102(c)(2), section 103(d)(2), or section 103(b) with respect to an Internet site, or otherwise voluntarily blocking access to or ending financial affiliation with an Internet site, in the reasonable belief that--
Intended to be targeting certain "pirate only" cites, except most torrent cites just give links to another place to download like hotfile, megavideo, fileshare... so THEY would be the ones being punished, not the "pirate" site. The people who lose advertising revenue, which pays for service costs, would take huge hits to profit.
Quote:
A service provider shall take technically feasible and reasonable measures designed to prevent access by its subscribers located within the United States to the foreign infringing site (or portion thereof) that is subject to the order, including measures designed to prevent the domain name of the foreign infringing site (or portion thereof) from resolving to that domain name's Internet Protocol address.
Here's the biggie. Sounds reasonable, except there are no limits on how far it can go. The gov can't take down youtube because it's too big, but for smaller sites no one cares about...
Quote:
A provider of an Internet search engine shall take technically feasible and reasonable measures, as expeditiously as possible, but in any case within 5 days after being served with a copy of the order, or within such time as the court may order, designed to prevent the foreign infringing site that is subject to the order, or a portion of such site specified in the order, from being served as a direct hypertext link.
Can you imagine how much work this is for Google? Tihs particular part would mess up Google's current search algorithm, create a ton of work for Google, and be somewhat similar to "Google China," the infamous censored search engine. I don't mean it'll be censored to that extent, but a similar algorithm would be used.

Also -- if the claim is deemed false in the end or the copyright removed for being to over-reaching, the person who brought the case STILL doesn't have to pay for the missed ad revenue (that there's no way to calculate, anyway). And the site/video is 'removed' until the legal mess is over. Legal messes can take years to sort through... and a couple years later, who cares about your song or whatever? It creates lost business opportunities.

And -- the way that they're asking service providers to 'block' our internet is actually quite easy to get around. Instead of using the actual URL, you can use a number sequence or go through TOR (TOR blacked out in protest, by the way). Because of this, it doesn't even effect the tech-savvy-ish "pirates" and instead the average internet user....

And on a final note -- They say that prosecutorial discretion will be used (unofficially) to deal with the cases in this matter, and assume that the mother having a song in the background of her video won't get it removed by the record label. Sure/maybe, but the video can be taken down.


My take on it

View Post Originally Posted by Twizzlerz
The Founding Fathers must be rolling in their graves over all the rights we have lost.
Brilliant Congress passed the Patriot Bill, but not one member took the time to read it - and we pay them for this?
Now they may just listen to big business.
Maybe a sane person wouldn't pass it, but we're talking about Congress.
If they won't read something dealing with basic rights, do you expect them to read SOPA? Or understand?
Will they next charge us for the air we breathe?
The bards of old kept our culture & knowledge alive; SOPA would be a nail in its coffin.

I support the WIKI blackout today! NO SOPA!


regarding "They shelved it" :
It was shelved because both parties have major retreats this week.
It is expected to be brought back up in February.

And Obama can't prevent something from passing.
He can veto a bill, but Congress can override a veto.

I just don't have faith in politicians. Most trained as lawyers, and they learn to talk out of the side
of their mouth to support their client regardless of whether they think they are guilty or not.
As often comes up in movies, as long as they don't know for sure, they are living by their professional code.

==================
Update: Here is a great piece from elsewhere by their member kllangellier:

I don't mean to be rude, but I don't think you quite understand what these sites are protesting. They ARE against piracy. They are also against censorship. US citizens would not be allowed to use many sites, including Amazon (didn't they just buy Woot or something?), Youtube, Wikipedia... And hey, you know that Facebook thing? Yeah, they'd get shut down too. Even if they disabled sharing links, all it would take is someone taking a video of their family singing Happy Birthday to a 5 year old and BAM Facebook is in violation. Or hey, what if you and a friend decide to meet up after having not seen each other in forever? You take a picture, and load it on Facebook. You know that shirt you're wearing? Well, that design is someone's intellectual property. And now, you've just uploaded an image to the internet that contains intellectual property / copyrighted material (that you don't own) for people to view. YOU have just broken the law.
...



____________________
Support the WIKI blackout 18Jan2012.....NO SOPA
Member: Save the Twinkees! & other Hostess treats. Join in the Gamez section.
About the politicians -- I agree, they're doing this because of the donations they got from the movie/recording industries, but not a shocker since that's how the system works (much to my dislike). But have SOME faith, because Ron Wyden (Oregon) (Hope I got his name right) is actually trying to get other members to sign on and filibuster the bill. He won't pull the 24 hour stunt like the other guy who tried (although not for this bill)

View Post Originally Posted by labradorian
YES!

OK, so I just put in a little research to see what this law would do, and the basses of it is pretty much to block sights and particular places with copyright infringement. However, it would give incredible power to the government. They could perfectly easily block something that wasn't copyrighted. (Anti-government sights for example). They could monitor Facebook and twitter and have the ability to delete posts (or tweets). I think it is putting too much in government hands and should be protested. NO SOPA!

Note: An easy way to protest is to click on the Google image which will direct you to place that will allow you to add your name to a perdition against this bill.
Well yes, but actually the government doesn't have the best coders & crackers, private companies and random Americans do. I don't think the government can actually control TOR, and the way that they're blocking it is dodgeable anyway. But having that law on the books is disgraceful.

The power actually goes to the record companies, who can take ANYTHING down if they claim to have a copyright on it. So a new song from a minor record label & not a subsidiary? Well then, how about they say "we own part of this song," have it taken off the internet, and get into a legal battle? When it's over, perhaps years later, no one cares about the song and the big label does't have to pay any money to the little one for damages/losses. Is this the kind of system we want? It just encourages monopolization.
The record companies do go to insane lengths to protect their stuff. You know how videos get removed if they're infringing? And it's mandatory too take them down, not optional? Well, a site called hotfile agreed with Warner basically that if Warner said take it down, they would. And then, because Warner has rights to a show called House, they took down everything with "House" or any other show name in the title. Obviously, a lot of these files weren't actually related or infringing on Warner's ownership of the TV show. In the end, this took down something like 10% of ALL of hotfile's files. And then they got into a HUGE legal mess...
^ Eventually Warner admitted to sending false takedown requests, and their response now is to try and put this through -.-

View Post Originally Posted by mickey26
Hmm..would that effect me at all if I live in Canada? Very interesting...
Yes. The legislatures are claiming that it doesn't affect people in the US, but in reality since US citizens helped found the internet US, most domain names are registered in the US. This bill messes around with them, which can REALLY mess around with the internet...

Last edited by cocogirl211; 01-18-2012 at 10:26 AM..
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Old 01-18-2012, 12:45 PM   #28
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Default Re: Our Internet?

While I understand the desire to protect copywrited material online (movies, music, etc.), I think the government should stay out of trying to control it. It would be devasting to the internet if this bill passes. Everyone would be effected. Freedom always comes with some risk, and I think it's good that people are debating it. The government should not be allowed to have so much power over this arena of free speech.
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Old 01-18-2012, 01:46 PM   #29
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Default Re: Our Internet?

Look! they changed the banner!
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Old 01-18-2012, 02:18 PM   #30
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Default Re: Our Internet?

View Post Originally Posted by Desty
While I understand the desire to protect copywrited material online (movies, music, etc.), I think the government should stay out of trying to control it. It would be devasting to the internet if this bill passes. Everyone would be effected. Freedom always comes with some risk, and I think it's good that people are debating it. The government should not be allowed to have so much power over this arena of free speech.
^^^ this

View Post Originally Posted by rainzz
Look! they changed the banner!
That's good.
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